Artist, CEO, and first-time Community Manager with Nora Mattsson
(You can also watch this episode on YouTube.)
Today’s guest is Nora Mattsson, a first-time community manager, 2D artist, and CEO at Studio Downstairs, a small indie game studio based in Sweden. Nora and her team are currently developing Find or Be Found, an asymmetric co-op horror game inspired by titles like Keep Talking and Nobody Explodes and Amnesia.
In this episode, Nora discusses her multifaceted role within the studio, highlighting the challenges and rewards of community management within an indie environment. She shares insights into building early communities around game prototypes, the strategic use of platforms like itch.io and Discord, and leveraging smaller content creators for impactful outreach.
Nora also provides practical tips for first-time community managers, emphasizing patience, careful observation of successful studios, and the importance of engaging genuinely with your community.
Games mentioned in this episode:
Find Nora on:
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Transcription
Steve McLeod
Today I’m joined by Nora Mattson. Last week I asked on LinkedIn for first time community managers to get in touch because I wanted to create a couple of episodes where I interview them. Nora was one of the people who jumped at the opportunity. Indeed, she is a first time community manager, but as I learned, she is also wearing many hats at studio downstairs in Sweden where yes, she is the community manager, but she’s also a 2D artist and even CEO. Welcome to the show, Nora.
Nora Mattsson
Thank you. Thank you, Steve, so much. Thank you so much for having me.
Steve McLeod
Tell me a little bit about Studio downstairs. Let’s start there.
Nora Mattsson
No, yeah. As I mentioned, they studio in Sweden with hybrid remotes. We are four founders, all juniors in our own way. So we are working right now on an asymmetric co-op horror game where you play as robbers. We have one hacker eh and one robber trying to find a specific item. It’s like a Keep talking and nobody explodes, Amnesia, kind of game. That’s what we’re doing.
Steve McLeod
And when are you having to release that?
Nora Mattsson
we are hoping for this year, this summer.
Steve McLeod
I’m not sure if I can ask this, what about funding? When you’re team of four juniors making your own studio, how do you get funding for such a thing?
Nora Mattsson
That’s of course the million dollar question, right?
Steve McLeod
Or the $100,000 question depending on your needs.
Nora Mattsson
No, yeah, we are having uh some kind of, what do you call it, set up right now where we have some people like full projects on boarding because we have school funds supporting them and then we have me and another person working part time. So it’s a give and take, but we’re managed. The good thing about our project and how, Studio Downstairs is part of this community, right? Where you get support from the business side of the game. So we come up with the idea and game and they help out with the business. The Science Park, yeah?
Steve McLeod
The science park that’s in Skövde in Sweden, which I learned about in season one when I talked to Ellinor as well as Jeremy Felding also mentioned it a bit. So it’s amazing. It’s amazing how this little city in Sweden has so influential in the games industry.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, it’s very awesome to see some of the big names coming from here like Valheim, Goat Simulator, etc. But yeah, so with their help we are able to also build verification for the project to help us get funding, right? So we were in a pitch competition, we won 100,000 crowns, that’s like 10,000 euros-ish.
Steve McLeod
Oh, that must have been a help.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, it’s very, that was our big breakthrough in funding wise to help us with hardware and trips and just the morale boost were, yeah.
Steve McLeod
Yeah. Yeah. It’s money. Sure. Everybody likes money, but it’s also like a confirmation that people believe in what you’re doing, that there is a path forward.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah.
Steve McLeod
Hey, so this podcast is supposed to be about community management. So I want to concentrate on your, on one of your multiple roles that as a community manager. So what does it involve being a community manager in such a small new studio? What do you do from day to day in the community management part of your role?
Nora Mattsson
Exactly. No, it’s with like a small team and also being new to like that kind of role and like everything with the setup. It’s a lot of trying to fit like your schedule with like the posts and like the engaging the community. So our game, which also eh was a part of like the verification phase, is that it’s a horror game and streamers are big on horror games, right? So we dropped a prototype on itch, which got a lot of traction, which we then used as a part of the pitch that we could get the monies from. So in our like, in my like day to day, I tried to reach out to like these communities of streamers and like to try to find like, this is game for you maybe and like that kind of approach.
Steve McLeod
Do you already have a community of like test players or beta players or people interested because of a demo?
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, so with each prototype we had we had people we have like had contacts continued contact with them like during the development now a year later and they’ve always been like that supportive so it’s much just we trying to gather them at our Discord of course and like that kind of engagement but also to get people in.
Steve McLeod
I just, I just have to interrupt for people who are watching this video, because this is also a video as well as an audio podcast. I just watched a black cat walk behind you. Um, you know, it’s bad luck in some cultures for a black cat that costs across your path, but then another cat of lighter color followed it. It was really funny to see that happen. Hi cats.
Nora Mattsson
You might see them fight behind me, but we’ll see.
Steve McLeod
So tell me about your path into community management. What have you done before, before Studio Downstairs in the realm of community management? What got you there?
Nora Mattsson
So, Skövde being a game city, I moved here to study to study arts, arts in games. And that’s also been that’s also part of my passion in games. But with the how the industry looks, etcetera, etcetera, me and some friends, they’re like, OK, let’s do our own thing. And like with that comes more roles. So I also applied for a education here.
Steve McLeod
Scholarship or?
Nora Mattsson
A education in digital games and community management. So with that I learned the tools. Community Management wasn’t something I always thought I would do. I’m not that, I’m kind of more a lurker online. I don’t really engage in the discussions if you don’t have anything nice to say. I don’t say it in that kind of like approach and also like being, I don’t know, a girl online can also cause some like traction of course. So I’ve always like kept myself at the back of it. But with like this education I received, like giving me tools and like a more understanding like marketing and community management, it’s a whole different field. Like it’s an own business side of everything and how the world revolves around marketing, etc. So it really opened an eye for me to how you can find players and engage in that. So that was kind of how I grew into it. And during this education, also during the same time, our game blew up in that sense.
Steve McLeod
Oh, you were working on the game while you were still studying.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, yeah.
Steve McLeod
Okay, okay. I already liked what you said that you lurked. If you didn’t have anything positive to say, you didn’t say anything at all. I really wish more people would do that in the gaming world. Really.
Nora Mattsson
I always try to think like my grandma watching over me.
Steve McLeod
Oh boy, that’s what we should write in the top of all forums and so on. Write as if your grandmother was watching over your shoulder.
Nora Mattsson
And of course they could also… Yeah, I mean, a good grandma in that sense.
Steve McLeod
A good grandmother, yeah. The thing about how females are treated way different online than males, it reminded me of back in the World of Warcraft day. I don’t know if you were around when that was a thing.
Nora Mattsson
I mean, I’ve been around, but I’ve not been in the Warcraft area.
Steve McLeod
So I created a world when I first got into World of Warcraft, I created a character and avatar that was all like male, muscly and strong and bit scary looking. And the other place left me alone. And then as an experiment, I created another character, another avatar. And this one was very fem, it was female, very feminine looking. And like immediately people came and started interacting with me and I was shocked because normally I would always just create a male character. And to play as a female, to see the way people just basically didn’t leave me alone. It was, it was an eye opener for this, this white male here to see that.
Nora Mattsson
It’s not that, and that’s like, that’s only a part of like the minority within the gaming community, eh? There’s a lot of other layers to explore as well. But yeah, it’s interesting.
Steve McLeod
Yeah, it is. It is. And I think even the name you pick to use on a, people can’t even see you, but the name you pick in a community on Reddit or Discord or something, I think even that is a factor in how people respond to you.
Nora Mattsson
I don’t want to derail more on this but I have a friend, yeah but I have a co-worker, like a colleague his online name is like Swamp Mom but like in Swedish. But so if we meet Swedish, other Swedish people online they always go at him first, like they always like type something, something like trying to anger so I am and like me I have kind of an anonymous name.
Steve McLeod
Mm-hmm. Like without gender.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah.
Steve McLeod
So to male listeners, here’s a challenge. Next time you create an account on some forum or community, try making the name something that sounds very feminine and see the reaction you get. I think if you haven’t done it before, it’s an eye-opener.
Steve McLeod
Do you want to tell me about a story of a memorable positive moment as a community manager?
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, Yeah, okay, so our development has been in different kind of phases. So I mentioned this itch prototype that we released. We got some big streamers to record it. When people saw this itch game, they recorded it, and other people saw it as well, and that kind of got the ball moving, right?
Steve McLeod
Did you design the game or create the game with the idea of making it good to watch or good for streaming?
Nora Mattsson
We did have a… like that kind of approach with the horror-esque and releasing it on itch. That’s also like a part of the difficulty within like the social media and community management, how… How do we reach out to people? How would they respond? Don’t they get these kind of emails every day? How can we stand out in an ocean of other horror games. uh
Steve McLeod
And how can you stand out? Tell me, tell me the tricks because it’s a good problem. I mean, it’s a real problem that everybody understands trying to get somewhere with a creative endeavor. How do you make people actually notice what you’re doing in the ocean of noise? So what did you do? How did you get these people to actually notice you and itch and then to, to share the videos?
Nora Mattsson
So us being a small studio, we know our limits, or try, we think we know, we’re learning them as we go at least. We also know that others, as well as other small streamers, they also have their… So that’s just our approach to meet in the middle. We don’t need to go for the big names. If we can just reach some… Because that was also like a reaction we got when we reached out to small streamers or YouTubers, content creators, I should say. You could see like the reaction in how like, how they felt the honor to have a game developer reach out to them. I think game developers have this Rock star feeling to it sometimes. So if you can find, it’s really about finding the right smaller like their streamers that they’re.
Steve McLeod
Okay. I like that. So instead of aiming for the well-known names who get pitched 10 times a day, you’re aiming for people with a smaller audience or newer to what they’re doing. And then taking advantage of the fact that you are a developer, game developer and really using that to flatter them. Not flatter. That sounds a little bit superficial, but yeah.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, and also when I say small, don’t like wanna… Like we’re also small in a sense, but it’s more like just find like-minded streamers and try to get them to find a collaboration with you.
Steve McLeod
Yeah, great. Moving on. Do you have a story of a challenge you’ve faced as a community manager that stands out in your memory, apart from being treated differently because you’re a female as opposed to how males are taught? I think we covered that.
Nora Mattsson
So being a like being new to the gaming like the game dev and the junior aspect of it all I find it difficult to know or like to plan what’s ahead. I can plan like okay we should do this to get this much engagement but what do we do with this engagement and have like that kind of strategy.
Steve McLeod
So you’re kind of feeling like you’re wandering alone, unguided with it.
Nora Mattsson
Exactly, it’s difficult to walk blind sometimes and having like the other teammates also having their tasks and like developing the game while I manage more like the administration, like the community. I can’t always like delegate the tasks even if you should ask for help etc. One of the biggest challenges is also to know what’s a priority. And when you find the engagement, what to do with it to prioritize to your time. You can’t do it all.
Steve McLeod
So given that situation that you’re a first timer uh at what you’re doing and you kind of feel like you need guidance, what do you do to try and get help? Do you go outside of your own studio?
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, yeah, like being having other Community Managers like they manage their community and I manage mine and we should manage each other. No, but we should like to find a some kind of bar plank like listen to this kind of podcast. I think it’s a great way to learn and take notes, but it’s also to find a good approach like I’ve listened to this podcast and the GDC Vault and other YouTube gamers toolkits etc. They have great tips but it’s also about how to apply that to you. Even if I listen to, this is good if you’re do a Reddit post, blah blah blah blah. But I don’t feel like, I don’t know if my audience is there or to find the prioritizing like the highest impacts.
Steve McLeod
Yeah, it’s hard. It’s hard. I like it. People don’t realize that running a game studio is in effect running a small business and running a businesses hard. Like if it was easy, everybody would be doing it. And what else do you do? Is there anybody you have mentoring you are there like real life or online communities that you’re a part of?
Nora Mattsson
I think online communities, just to find other game devs is a great way to… Like there’s this Chris Zukowski, man within marketing, he has a Discord server, many other game developers have the same questions as you. To just like to brief that and ask questions, there people are very friendly, and others. I am friends with the previous guest of yours, like Ellinor. So she’s also, she has years on her and like, we have this kind of small Community Manager gatherings. Sometimes we’re just like ball play and like can ask questions if needed. But that’s not normal, I would say. I don’t know. It’s, I…
Steve McLeod
It’s not normal for you or it’s not normal in general?
Nora Mattsson
It’s not to take for granted. I have that, and if you have that, that’s great. But it’s not something you can just, oh, just ask your local Community Manager.
Steve McLeod
Why not? Why not? Tell me why one can’t do that.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, of course they can, if they don’t know them, it’s uh different in different cities and where people are. But online communities, I think would work great as that approach.
Steve McLeod
So I think you’re, very lucky living where you do, you know, the small city of the great gaming industry. Here in Barcelona, where I live is a, um, monthly meetup, Barcelona Game Creators or something like that. About 50 people turn up every time I like to go along just to get my pulse on the, on what’s happening. And, I don’t know if these things exist in cities across the world. I think they must exist wherever there’s a significant gaming industry.
Nora Mattsson
Maybe, maybe they do, yeah.
Steve McLeod
Yeah. But if you live in some small town without a gaming industry, then that must be hard. This one in Barcelona is fantastic. Like I really enjoy going each week or each month, two or three people stand up and talk for 10 minutes about something they’re doing or some aspect of it. And then afterwards we go for drinks. Hey, there’s another cat just turned into the shot.
Steve McLeod
So this is why I could question you about, it normal? Here in Barcelona it seems normal, but we’re a big city with a big gaming industry. But if I say, you, if anybody can find those things, if you can find real life people to meet up with, just to talk about what you’re doing, I think that’s fantastic.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah.
Steve McLeod
What tips do you have for first time community managers? Given that you are a first time community manager.
Nora Mattsson
Exactly, exactly, it’s… I think it’s important. the most difficult thing I’ve tried to face is that, like to admit, like to face that I am a community manager and that kind of that imposter syndrome, etcetera, and to accept that it’s okay to not… Also like reinvent the wheel and like do everything on your own in that sense to find like to do your research within your field or like your game and watch what others game like you have probably game inspirations for your game right so then you can see their social media like do that inventory stuff to do like okay did they do these kind of posts maybe we can do this that’s a good approach I would say. But this also, it takes time of course. So be patient with your safe self. Like you don’t have to do everything at once. I think I know what I need to do to make everything successful but I will not be able to. So I will have to prioritize and think smart.
Steve McLeod
I like that. Be patient with yourself and look, observe what other people are doing similarly. So is there a particular company or studio that you’ve found particularly good for, for observing what they do that you find inspiring?
Nora Mattsson
Oh, inspiration wise?
Steve McLeod
And you can’t say Deep Rock Galactic because everybody says Deep Rock Galactic.
Nora Mattsson
I haven’t actually checked them out, but they’re probably good. I think Victoria Tran is a very good person, like I don’t know, a commitment, like there with her both Among us and like, what’s the other one, Unpacking.
Steve McLeod
So here’s a little, um, what would you call it? A, um, breaking news or spoiler. So the very last episode of this season of this podcast is me interviewing Victoria Tran. We’ve already done the interview, but because she’s got a book coming out in July, I wanted to make it the very last episode. So it’s close to her book coming out so that, know, when we talk about her book.
Nora Mattsson
I pre-ordered it.
Steve McLeod
Have you?
Nora Mattsson
Yeah.
Steve McLeod
Okay. I haven’t, but I am going to buy it when it’s available. Well, you’ve pre-ordered it. I should be happy to hear that. She told me she’s been working on it for a couple of years, but that’s all for another episode. Yeah. So Victoria Tran News Theater, her book that will come out soon. Yeah. And her work on Among Us.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, but even if the game inspiration maybe don’t apply to your game, you can still see what kind of work they do. I think it’s important to not always… to analyze what takes time for you to make within your job. So for me, it could be the motion graphics. To make GIFs or edit videos. Okay, that takes time for me. What can I do to like, efficientize that? Rework, reuse or… Also a difficult part is like to… When you… When you get bored of your own content, that’s when like the content starts to stick with your audience.
Steve McLeod
Okay, okay.
Nora Mattsson
That’s what people say.
Steve McLeod
Uh-huh.
Nora Mattsson
And I think that’s true because like TikTok or the TikTok audience that that kind of algorithm mostly reach out to new people more than like your followers.
Steve McLeod
Gotcha.
Nora Mattsson
So every time you post something is probably totally fresh for like a majority of the people. So repeat yourself, repeat yourself. And that’s difficult for me to get in here, to get in on my brain.
Steve McLeod
You know, I had to learn that lesson myself. Um, we’ve now got to the point for every episode of this podcast. We’re promoting it at least six times. And I feel, I feel like won’t people think I’m just saying the same thing over and over and someone gave me the same advice. It’s like, actually most people don’t see what you post. And when you post for the second time, typically it’s different people. And if you’re lucky, you’re actually cover a good chunk of your audience after multiple posts. I really have that problem too. So we’re the same there. And yet you do it anyway. I like the way you described it. What was it when you’re, when you’re bored?
Nora Mattsson
When you start to get tired of it, your audience starts to get it. Hopefully.
Steve McLeod
Yeah, I like that. Hopefully. Yeah, hopefully. And look, it’s working for us. finding for me, I’m finding that over and over promoting stuff, even though I’m not really a self-promoter. I really have to get over this to do it. But it works. really does work. So you mentioned TikTok. Has TikTok been working for you as a way of promoting what you’re doing and reaching out to people and building a community?
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, with it taking time, it’s been not as much as we wanted to, like, be active. But we have noticed those posts who do well, we get a lot of wishlists from it. And… Have I? Yeah, exactly. I don’t know if I said our game’s title.
Steve McLeod
No, no you didn’t yet.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah so Find and Be Found is our…is our game.
Steve McLeod
Find or be found.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah.
Steve McLeod
Okay, wow, that sounds scary. Well, we definitely have a link to it also in the show notes. And so people will see that and maybe you can wishlist it if they’re into, tell me again the genre… horror?
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, asymmetrical co-op horror.
Steve McLeod
Asymmetric co-op horror. The gaming industry has so many like sub-genres upon sub-genres.
Nora Mattsson
Keywords, tags, yeah.
Steve McLeod
Exacltly. If someone’s listening to this and their dream is to become a community manager, what tips do you have for them?
Like for how they can become a community manager tips for becoming a community manager.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah. There are so many different paths, I’ve noticed. For me it’s been a like growing into the role kind of I didn’t know this was a thing at first but now I do and it’s opened my eyes with like my
education as mentioned but in the end it’s a people’s game right? You work with people, you try to eh engage with them so you must understand them in some kind of way you must have that kind of not niche eye but understand what they write like be nice, be clear like how can you interact with this like that kind of like psychology background I think it’s a good like to understand people.
Steve McLeod
So except that it’s a people role, which is important to recognize because if you’re not somebody who enjoys working directly with people you don’t know all day, then maybe community management’s the wrong role, right?
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, maybe. I think it’s anything, like you have to like to work with people, right? eh But maybe you have so much passion for the game that it’s more about like how you tell stories and etc. That also I think.
Steve McLeod
Great answer. Final question. And this is the most important question I’m going to ask you. What game or games have you been playing lately?
Nora Mattsson
It’s been a tough Winter, tough Autumn. But I have been gaming mostly Overwatch. Overwatch 2. There was a… I think I burned myself out on it this Autumn because I had to grind for a specific role, right, and I played so much and then I played nothing and now I’m back in it. Now it’s… I don’t want to say I play too much because I think I have… I need to play to distance myself from working. And I’m much of a more of a play with friends kind of gamer more than a single player gamer. But I want to get in more to single player games as well. So I’ve been trying to also come through Psychonauts, the first one. Because I want to play the second one.
Steve McLeod
Tell me what it is you like about Overwatch.
Nora Mattsson
eI like it very much because of the characters, I think. Also the… like the intensity of it. I think it’s fun to play with friends. It’s fun.
Nora Mattsson
Of course it has like this, you know we talked before, like with the online chat, but I’ve gained so much more confidence with it, I think.
Steve McLeod
Because you’re able to chat while you play.
Nora Mattsson
Yeah, yeah, and I’m not as afraid to speak out as I was when I was before. I think I have a lot to thank from Overwatch or previous games.
Steve McLeod
And you tend to be speaking in English or in Swedish when you’re playing Overwatch?
Nora Mattsson
English.
Meeting Swedish players online, like, I don’t know, they’re weird. English speaking people are much nicer.
Steve McLeod
I think, I think the role of video games in encouraging and promoting the use of English is really underrated. People don’t realize just how much video games they’re helping non-native English speakers get a chance to practice and use English. Really. I, know, here in Spain, I see the kids around me who like they watch, YouTube videos and streamers in English. Like this is part of the thing they enjoy about it is it’s a chance to practice their English. They sometimes learn the wrong English words I have to say.
Nora Mattsson
Well that’s, you live and you learn, like…
Steve McLeod
And do you find anything about Overwatch or Psychonauts that you learn from how they do community? Is there anything you see what they’re doing that you can then apply to your own job?
Nora Mattsson
I really like how Overwatch are collaborating with their streamers. I think that’s kind of interesting and inspiring in a sense that they invite them for special events or like… Now, it’s an inspiration, right? Special events or like you can give like special content for like the stream or like partner up. I think that’s also a very good gateway em to reach out to people to have them the graphics ready at start. So give them maybe a special banner for their stream or like this is a find a profound collab or to give them the exclusivity. I think that’s a very interesting.
Steve McLeod
Nice, nice. On that note, we need to finish up because we have run out of time. That’s all we have time for today. So thanks again, Nora, for coming on the show.
Nora Mattsson
Thank you so much for having me.
Steve McLeod
And where can people get in touch or find out more about you or Studio Downstairs or Find or Be Found?
Nora Mattsson
The game will be on Steam and I am on LinkedIn as Nora Mattsson.
Steve McLeod
We’ll have that in the show notes. Okay, thank you. Bye, Nora.
Nora Mattsson
Thank you so much. Bye, Steve.
Steve McLeod
Bye everyone.